Brian Wilde left at one point to pursue another comedy about neighborhood watch,not a success.Still think he was the best third man only Truly got anywhere near as good but improved eventualy.Foggy had a knack of involving many unwilling people in his schemes even if they did not want to.
Brian Wilde
- Thread starter Foggy Entwhistle
- Start date
codfanglers
Dedicated Member
I am rereading these posts about Brian Wilde as I am preparing to write about the Seymour era. I am quite amused by many of these. Foggy, Blamire, Seymour, and Truly were the lead guys IMO. I saw Clagg as the middle man all that time and Compo as the one in charge of a bulk of the outrageous and physical humor. However, we could debate who is first, second, and third forever as I guess it is just a matter of how one looks at the show.
Also, I found it interesting that some may feel Compo was a link between Clegg and Blamire, Seymour, or Foggy. Like Big Unc, I firmly thing of Clegg as the bridge between the other two as Foggy, Seymour, or Blamire were complete opposites of Compo. It appears in real life, Sallis was a bridge between Wilde and Owen, who couldn't get along.
barmpot
LOTSW Fanatic
I also wonder whether our preference for Foggy, Seymour and so on might not relate to when we first watched the programme. The initial set up would probably, subconsciously, be the yardstick for all that follows. I did not see the Blamire years until much later on (late 1980s when they came out on video) and thus regarded Foggy as very much the part of the irreplaceable three! I came across Seymour and I was less impressed at first because I wanted what I had originally seen.
Just a thought ...
Just a thought ...
E
Eli Thingy
Guest
a very good point barmpot and agree with what u say, the era we started with is what is defined as our favourite time of the show
I step out of line and do not concur. I started watching in the Blamire years. Did not like the switch to Foggy - I always found him irritating. His sort of character I never like in real life. But then I did not take to Seymour, missing Foggy a bit, even though Michael Aldridge was a far superior actor to Brian Wilde (and a far nicer person). As the years went on I got more and more drawn to the figure of Clegg and felt that his character and the lines and insights he was given just kept on improving. So, my favourite years were when Clegg, Truly, Billy Hardcastle and Alvin were the four. But it had little to do with Truly. It was mainly the Clegg and Hardcastle dialogue coupled with some of Truly's interjections and Alvin's inanities. And I totally appreciated the contributions of Norman Wisdom and Bobby Ball as two of the most frequent guest stars.
codfanglers
Dedicated Member
I will have to agree overall with Barmpot, a disagree with Big Unc this time. Our absolute favorite third man might not be who we saw first, but I believe we develop a preference to them. I hve viewed a few rotations of Summer Wine at this point. Oddly enough, when I first discovered Summer Wine, the Truly era was being aired on the weekdays and the Seymour era was being aired on Saturdays. As a result I liked these two more than Foggy for quite a while (not that I didn't like Foggy). But now as I finished the Seymour era another new channel, WETA-UK started airing Summer Wine as well and I have been catching the early Foggy episodes. After about 3-4 years of watching Summer Wine (not always as committed to it as I am now) I am finally having Foggy become my favorite character. I find that he had more depth than the other characters.
Now as Big Unc mentioned, he didn't like the character of Foggy in real life, I think in another day I will write about real life preferences and characters. Because sometimes, a writer might develop a character with negative traits, but this is sometimes to compliment other characters and play on such traits for comic reasons. It reminds me of the old posts about Howard and Pearl where everyone was complaining about how they treated each other. They were never meant to be the ideal couple, instead their flaws were used as part of Clarke's comedy.
I do agree with Big Unc in that the dialogue and perhaps the characters improved over the years. I mentioned that I think Foggy had the most depth, but I will have to closely observe Compo, Clegg, Truly, and Billy in later years to see if they develop such depth.
And on a final note, I don't always like the background music played in Summer Wine. I think the show might be better off without it. However, I just love it when they do the military drum beat during the Foggy scenes. I think that adds to his comedy of mishaps.
Foggy Entwhistle
Active Member
When Brian Wilde returned in 1990 had he buried his differences with Bill Owen? Why did he refuse to come back to the series after he left for the second time, did he realise he wasn't liked by the rest of the cast?
Quote from Vine's book: 'Wilde recovered fully from his illness (shingles), but turned down repeated invitations to bring Foggy back, saying, "Although I have often been invited to return, I always refuse as I feel I have done it and enjoyed it."'
Prior to his going, Vine tells us that, 'Wilde wanted to do less and less and asked for Foggy's role to be downgraded. Clarke obliged and and several of the scripts for the next series would feature only brief appearances for the character to give him more time off, with Compo and Clegg embarking on adventures by themselves.'
My interpretation is that series never appeared because of Wilde's illness and Truly showed up for Series #19.
Brian Wilde was a complex person who even sacked his agent a move not advised by Alun Bell ,he seemed to be a spiky character not at like Mr Barracluff in Porridge.I personaly always liked him his character appealed but my wife always found him annoying.Billy Hardcastle should have followed as third man .
Regarding Brian Wilde being an awkward character I think it's important to remember there are two sides to every story. Vines book is just one persons perspective and by all accounts Bill Owen wasn't the easiest person to get along with. He fell out with Michael Bates as well as Brian Wilde which would suggest he was no angel, I read somewhere he wanted to make sure he always had the funniest lines. Tom Owen has also spoken about his relationship with his father. None of us were there, so we sadly will never know, we can only go by what people account which can be biased.
Regarding summerwine Foggy was always my favourite he had a connection that the others didn't have with Compo and Cleggy and I loved the way he annoyed Wesley, and I personally think as an actor Brian Wilde was the equal to Michael Aldridge. 1990-1997 was my favourite era for last of the summer wine, I never liked Seymour at the time but now looking back on him I have warmed to him. I never cared either way for Blairmire and I have to admit I enjoyed Truley as a character as he was totally different. Don't get me started on Russ Abbots character
Regarding summerwine Foggy was always my favourite he had a connection that the others didn't have with Compo and Cleggy and I loved the way he annoyed Wesley, and I personally think as an actor Brian Wilde was the equal to Michael Aldridge. 1990-1997 was my favourite era for last of the summer wine, I never liked Seymour at the time but now looking back on him I have warmed to him. I never cared either way for Blairmire and I have to admit I enjoyed Truley as a character as he was totally different. Don't get me started on Russ Abbots character
to be fair to Andrew Vine, he's fairly even handed in his descriptions of the behind teh scenes relationships. He talks about how difficult Bill Owen could be, in particular how his belief that he was the main star of the show could rub others up the wrong way.
It's a funny thing, that, I suppose. Bill Owen always thought he was the star, probably he was the most recognisable. Brian Wilde seemed to think he was the star, and I read somewhere he was paid more than the rest, but to my mind it was only ever Mr Sallis who actually was the star. Don't get me wrong, I loved them all, but Mr Sallis seemed to hold it all together.
I am with you there, young Rhi. Bill Owen's contention was based on his having been in cinema film more than the others. There was some cachet to it back then. But to me the real actor has had to show a real ability on stage and that is where Peter Sallis and Michael Aldridge had the edge. And yes, reports were that Brian Wilde was paid almost twice as much as the other two which certainly caused some friction and to my mind could not be justified.
But then, particularly now I find very little the BBC does in paying out ridiculous sums to nonentities and the talentless can be justified, not no how.
I always feel inclined to trust Andrew Vine on the basis that he seemed to be trusted by and have the confidence of all the cast. If he has a perspective it is, I suggest, from the standpoint of Roy Clarke and Alan JW Bell (and his predecessors).
Foggy Entwhistle
Active Member
Never reralised Brian was payed more than the other charactars, no wonder Bill Owen didn't get on with him. Peter Sallis always seemed to be the peacemaker to his credit.