Compo saying the F Word

sidjames

New Member
Is it just me or in the episode 'The Kink in Foggy's Niblick' when Foggy's playing golf, and finally hits the ball, he looks round to find Compo gone and he says 'where's f**k face' ?

It's around the 24th minute and had me in tears after I heard it. Some people must have known this ?
 

Pearl

Administrator
Staff member
Yes defiantly frogface, even when the show went out later in the evening they never used that kind of language.
 
D

DJWCFC

Guest
yeah that sort of language was never used on summer wine, the most was mild swearing like bl***y
 

George

Super Moderator
I think the closest we came to the f word was in Happy Anniversary Gough and Jessie when Seymour says "For who?" and Compo replies "For Gough" :)
 
D

DJWCFC

Guest
well the way i look at it is no way would roy clarke, alan bell or any of the earlier directors allow language like that on a bbc show, the bbc in the old days wouldnt allow it with a show aimed at a family audience, they allow it now look at the bad language in mrs brown boys every episode
 

wstol

Dedicated Member
Something very wrong the way tv comedy is presented nowadays.

It was noted on a very recent thread that some DVDs have blurred out some girlie images on magazines and calenders on episodes of LOTSW - which previously made it on VHS at PG rating.

Cable tv stations are stripping episodes of old tv programmes if so much as the word 'black' is mentioned.

Yet they are all in favour for maximum bad language and 'unnecessary' filth immediately after 9 o'clock.

On GOLD and the like, all day is devoted to 'nice' programmes, generally suitable for all. Come 9 o'clock, when I've got a chance to sit down and watch some for a couple of hours, all the foul mouthed stand up comedians always seem to be on.

Some more adult programmes do require a certain amount of bad language and suggestiveness. There is a time and a place for everything. But it ruins comedy shows.
 

gremlin

Dedicated Member
lots of fast replies to this today and must add for myself....definately frog......one of the joys of the programme has always been an absence of bad language, ok in some of the earlier episodes we had...bloody...but that didnt last long, noticeable when ivy changes bloody to what the blood and stomach pills....has always been better for losing any sort of bad language in my opinion... :)
 

Philosopher Clegg

Dedicated Member
I occasionally explore some of the older threads and came across this one which has the wrong title in that it mentions Compo using the F-word, when the scene is Foggy. I couldn't recall this and I had to have a look at the episode but as others have said Foggy definitely says Frogface, it's not even close to that other word.

However, there are numerous occasions in LOTSW when Compo does give someone, mostly Foggy if memory serves, the two finger v-sign gesture which is the equivalent of the spoken f-word. The audience seem to find this funny. Is it more acceptable to do this than actually say the f-word? The meaning is basically the same and by the time Compo was doing this the series was probably shown earlier in the evening. No one seemed to object and the BBC didn't censor it.

I found it funny whenever Compo did it. I can't recall many other comedies where it may have been used?
 

Sarkus

Dedicated Member
well the way i look at it is no way would roy clarke, alan bell or any of the earlier directors allow language like that on a bbc show, the bbc in the old days wouldnt allow it with a show aimed at a family audience, they allow it now look at the bad language in mrs brown boys every episode
It wasn't a family show in the early days, though, and "Kink" is from Series 3. There was even occasional nudity in the form of magazines or pictures in the early years.
 
D

DJWCFC

Guest
It wasn't a family show in the early days, though, and "Kink" is from Series 3. There was even occasional nudity in the form of magazines or pictures in the early years.
I can understand where your coming from Sarkus, but even if that was allowed the BBC of old would never have allowed a very strong swear word on one of there shows even after the watershed, in those days the BBC was very protective over it shows, unlike now
 

barmpot

LOTSW Fanatic
When I was younger, a v-sign was common. Certainly not construed as being particularly bad unlike using certain words (that were not even spelt in full in slang dictionaries, I used to think they had run out of "u"s and thus used "*" instead) in those days. I recall that when it first appeared in print (Lady Chatterley's Lover in 1963 or possibly 1962) it was a milestone in changing standards and then Kenneth Tynan uttered it on a live Tv programme.

It was probably becoming less common by the mid to late 1070s, which fits with SW's slightly anachronistic feel. Although this was common to a lot of the industrial West Riding - when I came to live in Yorkshire in the 1970s it was, even in Leeds, several years behind in terms of fashion and general approaches compared to the south where I had previously lived.

So really it is older men behaving as they would have done in their youth when a V-sign was a common way of expressing disapproval.
 

Philosopher Clegg

Dedicated Member
When I was younger, a v-sign was common. Certainly not construed as being particularly bad unlike using certain words (that were not even spelt in full in slang dictionaries, I used to think they had run out of "u"s and thus used "*" instead) in those days. I recall that when it first appeared in print (Lady Chatterley's Lover in 1963 or possibly 1962) it was a milestone in changing standards and then Kenneth Tynan uttered it on a live Tv programme.

It was probably becoming less common by the mid to late 1070s, which fits with SW's slightly anachronistic feel. Although this was common to a lot of the industrial West Riding - when I came to live in Yorkshire in the 1970s it was, even in Leeds, several years behind in terms of fashion and general approaches compared to the south where I had previously lived.

So really it is older men behaving as they would have done in their youth when a V-sign was a common way of expressing disapproval.
I don't think giving the V-sign, palm in, has ever been anything but a rude gesture, often done with aggressive intent. For as long as I've known it the gesture was associated with two words, f-off. However, like the origin of many words or gestures it is not obvious when a certain meaning was applied to the gesture.

It is thought that the original putting up of two fingers came from the battle of Agincourt to the French. The bowmen supposedly did this because the French would cut their bow fingers off if they were taken prisoner, so they stuck two fingers up to them. More recent study suggests that this is an urban myth and that there is no evidence that the bowmen did give the French two fingers at Agincourt or anywhere else.

As to when it became associated with the F-word is also difficult to say. Not clear, but there are a number of possible interpretations.

Here's an interesting old video suggesting when it was first caught on film in 1901. Filmed in Rotherham as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I64ewblmTUY

I would say certainly in modern times, at least covering the LOTSW era, it has been seen as an F-word gesture. I think even Churchill during WW2 eventually made sure that his hand was palm out with the V for victory sign as quite often he did it both ways and was advised not to.

The Churchillian gesture

"Winston Churchill took up the Victory campaign enthusiastically, and made a V sign with his fingers whenever a camera was pointed at him, his palm facing in both directions. This dismayed his private secretary, John Colville. In September 1941, Colville wrote in his diary, ''The PM will give the V-sign with two fingers in spite of representations repeatedly made to him that this gesture has quite another significance.''
 

barmpot

LOTSW Fanatic
Interesting comments -agree it is meant to be insulting but in 1950s and early 1960s where I lived it was certainly regarded as less rude than using the F word, actually a lot less rude. I am not sure we regarded it as aggressive - more just a reaction to something of which we disapproved.

However all that means is that social studies have to take account of the location and context when analysing these instances; sometimes there are local variations which we would not see now at all as words, phrases and gestures are all much more universal than they were when I was growing up, when quite localised variations did occur. So my recollection is correct and others' recollections are also correct but each based on their own background and cultural norms.

Personally I blame Desmond Morris!
 

barmpot

LOTSW Fanatic
Just also realised that Roy Clarke's own recollections and cultural influences are pertinent here - he wrote it!
 

Philosopher Clegg

Dedicated Member
Interesting comments -agree it is meant to be insulting but in 1950s and early 1960s where I lived it was certainly regarded as less rude than using the F word, actually a lot less rude. I am not sure we regarded it as aggressive - more just a reaction to something of which we disapproved.

However all that means is that social studies have to take account of the location and context when analysing these instances; sometimes there are local variations which we would not see now at all as words, phrases and gestures are all much more universal than they were when I was growing up, when quite localised variations did occur. So my recollection is correct and others' recollections are also correct but each based on their own background and cultural norms.

Personally I blame Desmond Morris!
Just also realised that Roy Clarke's own recollections and cultural influences are pertinent here - he wrote it!
On the few times that I've seen Compo use it, in the context of a comedy and the moment it was used it was funny, in the same way he jumps all over Nora Batty in an unacceptable way type funny, there's no intent to shock, but it does show that even in the most gentle of comedies there are things that we can look at and say, he wouldn't get away with that in real life. Compo does get away with lots of things, but he was the rebel of LOTSW and accepted as such.

As for Roy Clarke's own background he was writing for a national audience so must have been aware that even if historically it meant something different and more mild in Yorkshire, that's not the case in the way it was seen nationally.

I'm reminded of another Yorkshireman who got in trouble over its use. Harvey Smith.

1971: 'V-sign' costs rider victory

"Controversial horse rider Harvey Smith has been stripped of his £2,000 winnings and a major show jumping title for allegedly making a rude gesture.

Mr Smith was seen to make a two-fingered 'V-sign' in the direction of the judges after winning the British Show Jumping Derby.

The rider has protested his innocence, claiming the judges mistook his gesture.

"It was a straightforward V for victory. Churchill used it throughout the war," Smith said.

Both signs are made using an upwards motion with the first two fingers extended.

However the victory sign is made with the palm outwards and the obscene gesture with palm inwards."

He was re-instated, but later apparently admitted in interviews that he was making the obscene gesture.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/august/15/newsid_2534000/2534107.stm

That happened in the early 1970's, and I remember it being quite a controversy at the time and for a while at least the two finger salute was known as "doing a Harvey Smith".
 

barmpot

LOTSW Fanatic
Actually my experience - childhood - was in the sunny south! So might have been different here - I only migrated northwards in the 1970s but after SW had started!
 

goodiesguy

Dedicated Member
I've always assumed the two finger salute to mean "up yours" which would make far more sense, although it means more or less the same thing as the f-word.
 

Don

Dedicated Member
I always thought the two fingered "salute" was the equivalent of giving someone "the bird" as we say in the states when we use the middle finger to basically say, "F-you"
 
Top