Odd use of a Foggy double in "The Black Widow"

Sarkus

Well-Known Member
I was watching this episode last night and noticed something for the first time: at the end, when the widow mistakenly pulls Foggy onto the dance floor (instead of Smiler, who Compo meant to indicate was the "tall person" interested in her), the long shot is clearly using a Foggy double. You can tell by his hair, which doesn't match Foggy's. There are close-ups after where they used Brian Wilde, but not that long shot.

As the scene simply involves Foggy being pulled onto the dance floor, the only thing I can guess is that maybe Wilde was having some health issue that day. He is sitting when she approaches, so maybe he just wasn't up to the scene for some reason.

Just seemed like an oddity.
 

brendalovescompo

Well-Known Member
will pay more attention next time I watch. I recall him seeming to have more hair when he was sitting there, but I am use to him always wearing a hat.
 

Sarkus

Well-Known Member
It stands out because Foggy's hair is completely white by then but the double still has a lot of gray in the shot, where you only see the back of his head.
 

Elmc

Well-Known Member
I was watching this episode last night and noticed something for the first time: at the end, when the widow mistakenly pulls Foggy onto the dance floor (instead of Smiler, who Compo meant to indicate was the "tall person" interested in her), the long shot is clearly using a Foggy double. You can tell by his hair, which doesn't match Foggy's. There are close-ups after where they used Brian Wilde, but not that long shot.

As the scene simply involves Foggy being pulled onto the dance floor, the only thing I can guess is that maybe Wilde was having some health issue that day. He is sitting when she approaches, so maybe he just wasn't up to the scene for some reason.

Just seemed like an oddity.
You are right, Sarkus. I noticed that straight out when I first saw the episode. It's not Brian. And it never was him on the bike in Return of the Warrior either. I like noticing when they put a double in. How about Pole Star? Compo running in practice with the pole. As if. lol
 

chris

Well-Known Member
Always thought Foggys double was not very good he did not move like him and his hair was wrong at the back.
 

Sarkus

Well-Known Member
I realize they used doubles a lot as the years went on, and sometimes it was more obvious then others. But it really stood out in this case because of the hair, and because its not an obvious situation where you would need to use a double in.

Another really odd example is in "Bicycle Bonanza" (IIRC) after the trio rents the three bikes from Auntie. In the next scene you see the trio stop for a chat that focuses on Foggy and Compo in the foreground while Clegg messes with his bike in the background. Its obviously a double for Clegg the whole time, but for no real reason. I know that Peter Sallis wasn't comfortable on bikes, but its clearly him at various times in the episode, so I don't see why they used a double for that scene. The only thing I could ever guess in the "Bicycle Bonanza" scene is that he wasn't available for filming for whatever reason so they changed the scene to use the double.
 

Adanor

Well-Known Member
Sometimes it's hard to realize that what we see is wrapped up nice and tidy and a lot of effort goes into filming each scene. Sometimes, everything goes off as planned and other times an actor isn't up to snuff at that moment and it is useful to use a double. There are lots of scenes that look great but then you hear what an amazing amount of effort it took to film them.
 

Hector

Well-Known Member
The dance looks awkward and out of step just after Foggy is picked up which adds to the comedic effect.If Brian had slipped and fallen and twisted an ankle or broke his wrist this would have caused problems with shooting the rest of the series.It may even have needed a rewrite and so on so the director has probably taken the safest route and used a stuntman/standin.just in case.

In the very last shots of this scene we get a close up of Foggys face and I have been wondering if he is actually holding a sort of mannequin rather than Zara Nutley.

In Bicycle Bonanza we see three standins ride into the yard thing.Then the actors do their lines and the three standins are seen riding away.As Peter Sallis had no lines in that scene it was maybe handier just to use his standin instead.

Hector
 

Elmc

Well-Known Member
I realize they used doubles a lot as the years went on, and sometimes it was more obvious then others. But it really stood out in this case because of the hair, and because its not an obvious situation where you would need to use a double in.

Another really odd example is in "Bicycle Bonanza" (IIRC) after the trio rents the three bikes from Auntie. In the next scene you see the trio stop for a chat that focuses on Foggy and Compo in the foreground while Clegg messes with his bike in the background. Its obviously a double for Clegg the whole time, but for no real reason. I know that Peter Sallis wasn't comfortable on bikes, but its clearly him at various times in the episode, so I don't see why they used a double for that scene. The only thing I could ever guess in the "Bicycle Bonanza" scene is that he wasn't available for filming for whatever reason so they changed the scene to use the double.
Yes, Sarkus, I noticed that too. If he wasn't available that day, they could have well done without the scene.
 
C

Compo

Guest
The Black Widow

Are actors getting to lazy to constantly need doubles????? I can understand if someone has to fall off a ladder etc. But there are some scenes that a double is not really necessary.
 

Sarkus

Well-Known Member
Watched "Beware the Elbow" last night and noticed some obvious use of doubles as well. Near the end the trio and the other guy jog off after the escaping baloon and its really obvious that they are all doubles, especially Clegg. I think the guy they used for him never quite got Peter Sallis' mannerisms right as he stands out every time to me.

Whats also interesting in that episode is that when the ladies are up in the car stuck on the transporter after the balloon lands on them, you never actually see Edie in the car. There is a close-up of her, but it looks like they didn't put her up with the other ladies for the camera shots. Instead you see some movement behind Glenda that is presumably a double underneath the balloon. Seems like an oddity that the rest of the actors went up but Thora Hird did not.
 

brendalovescompo

Well-Known Member
I watched a summerwine home movie, someone had when they visited. Had the 3 getting out of the camper. All three needed assistance getting out of the trailer , and Foggy lost his step and almost fell.:whisper:I will find the link and post. It was late 90's I believe.
 

Sarkus

Well-Known Member
I watched a summerwine home movie, someone had when they visited. Had the 3 getting out of the camper. All three needed assistance getting out of the trailer , and Foggy lost his step and almost fell.:whisper:I will find the link and post. It was late 90's I believe.
I believe I've seen that one. No doubt they were incapable of really active movement, and the use of doubles for the jogging scene I mentioned above is understandable in that context. I was just noting it because usually the doubles weren't all that convincing, which for a show that used them for so long is a bit of a surprise. Nobody watches the Lord of the Rings trilogy, for example, and says "oh, there its obvious they were using a body double." And yes, I realize LOTSW isn't a big budget film, but my point is that body doubles are used all the time in movies and don't stand out like they almost always do in LOTSW. The use of "green screen" filming in later years is equally obvious, at least to me.
 

brendalovescompo

Well-Known Member
It does make you wonder why the excessive use of the doubles for the simpler scenes. I had never noticed in that dance hall scene. Just thought it was a bit odd that he was sitting so still and seemed fuzzing like Smiler was acting in front of a still screen shot of the double Foggy. That was a good eye Sarkus.:wink:
 

Adanor

Well-Known Member
I watched a summerwine home movie, someone had when they visited. Had the 3 getting out of the camper. All three needed assistance getting out of the trailer , and Foggy lost his step and almost fell.:whisper:I will find the link and post. It was late 90's I believe.
Yes, I saw the same home movie and it was most instructive. Bill Owen gave a wonderful "thumbs up" and Peter Sallis rode by himself. There are also lots of other home movies; all of which are also most instructive, interesting and very informative. A wonderful different perspective on exactly how LOTSW was produced.
 

maltrab

Administrator
Staff member
Sometimes they have to shoot a scene that has been missed,or did not work and the actor in the scene is not available on the day,so they use a double,I did see this happen on a couple of occasions when I used to watch them filming
 
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